Re: Signinig up, versions, passing UMOs [was: Passing UMOs]

[sergey@total-knowledge.com]

> 2007/1/8, sergey@total-knowledge.com <sergey@total-knowledge.com>:
>>
>> > BTW, there is an interesting thing about passing not the latest
>> version
>> of
>> > the UMO. If the version of UMO is passed and it isn't the latest
>> version
>> -
>> > then UMO isn't passed
>>
>> If any version of UMO U in Course A is passed, then _it_ _is_ _passed_
>> even if there are other versions of this UMO that may or may not belong
>> to
>> Course A.
>
>
> So,  it should also be true that if student passed any version of the UMO
> within course A, and this UMO is also included into course B, then that
> UMO
> is considered as already passed regardless of the latest version.
>

Yes, if Student passed problem P's version P-3 in Course A, it's
considered as already passed in Course B for this Student regardless of
any other version of P in Course B.
If that's what you asked.

>> since course requires the latest version.
>>
>> Any course _displays_ the latest versions of their UMOs by default(newer
>> than "latest" versions may belong to other courses or be available in
>> Repository). Older than "latest" versions available for Students in each
>> Course.
>>
>> > That made my day :)
>>
>> I think you are talking about passing a Course with bunch of UMOs that
>> belong to it. Let's say Student Bill successfully passed all UMOs in
>> Course A except problem P. Let's say P has 5 versions.
>> Course A has versions
>> P-1, P-2 and P-3(shown as default one)
>> There is another Course B that has versions
>> P-3, P-4 and P-5(shown as default one)
>>
>> In order to pass Course A and be eligible for voting on Course A,
>> student
>> Bill must pass P-1, P-2 and P-3 only. No need to pass P-4 and P-5 unless
>> Bill wants to vote on Course B.
>
>
> Strictly IMHO:
> Problem versions are independent of the course. Also, if the problem has N
> versions, only one of them should be available at the moment.
> Therefore, student should only study a problem once..
>

I don't see anything wrong with availability of all "older than current"
versions for Student. Most likely an average student _will_ study a
problem once without looking at any older versions of it.
That's why I disagree with the concept of passing all _available_ for the
particular student versions of UMO in order to vote on "parent UMO" this
UMO belongs to. Imho, passing one version of Problem P should be enough to
vote on Course, Topic, Test, etc that contain this Problem P.

>>
>> > 2007/1/7, Alexey Parshin <alexeyp@gmail.com>:
>> >>
>> >> This approach means, that if several courses include each different
>> >> versions of the same UMO, then to pass these courses one should study
>> >> all
>> >> the versions of the UMOs mentioned, and that is simply not fair. This
>> >> requires enormous waste of time for no particular reason, especially
>> if
>> >> differences between versions are minor. It would make more sense if
>> the
>> >> UMO
>> >> is considered as passed regardless of version. If the version changes
>> >> are
>> >> serious - then we should create another UMO.
>> >>
>> >> 2007/1/6, Ilya A. Volynets-Evenbakh <ilya@total-knowledge.com>:
>> >> >
>> >> > It's not a downside.
>> >> >
>> >> > sergey@total-knowledge.com wrote:
>> >> > > There is one downside I see at this point.
>> >> > > UU is going to have bunch of UMOs in the Repository that do not
>> >> belong
>> >> > to
>> >> > > any course. Imagine a situation when student finds a topic, a
>> test
>> >> or
>> >> > a
>> >> > > problem in Repository, but will not be able to study it because
>> he
>> >> > cannot
>> >> > > sign up for it directly.
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > >> Little clarification:
>> >> > >> Student can only _directly_ sign up for a course. All other UMOs
>> >> are
>> >> > >> signed up for indirectly.
>> >> > >> Which just made me realize how things should be:
>> >> > >> 1. Student can sign up to different versions of a course
>> (provided
>> >> he
>> >> >
>> >> > >> has rights for that - more on this later)
>> >> > >> 2. At the time student signs up for a course, he automatically
>> >> signs
>> >> > >> up for all all objects of that course, to versions that are
>> >> specified
>> >> > in
>> >> > >> the course at that time. IOW, a snapshot of a course is taken.
>> >> > >> 3. While student is studying, he will not see _any_ changes to
>> the
>> >> > >> course. IOW, retrieving version of an object to study will be
>> based
>> >> > >> on information in sign-up tables.
>> >> > >> 4. If there is an UMO of exact same version that student already
>> >> > >> studied, he will not be able to "study" it again - his results
>> from
>> >> > >> previous
>> >> > >> passage of this UMO will carry over. Otherwise he will have to
>> pass
>> >> > it
>> >> > >> again.
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >> Now, what we need is to adjust database schema to allow all of
>> this
>> >> > >> (I think some info on signing-up is missing right now, but I'll
>> let
>> >> > >> Alexey look into it himself).
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >> sergey@total-knowledge.com wrote:
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >>>> Alexey Parshin wrote:
>> >> > >>>>
>> >> > >>>>
>> >> > >>>>> If an author is really interested to see the difference -
>> then
>> >> he
>> >> > can
>> >> > >>>>> simply see the difference between old rating (before new
>> >> version)
>> >> > and
>> >> > >>>>> after. For instance, the rating was 4.5 and became 4.7 with
>> the
>> >> > new
>> >> > >>>>> version..
>> >> > >>>>>
>> >> > >>>>>
>> >> > >>>> True.
>> >> > >>>>
>> >> > >>>>
>> >> > >>>>> After all, people who passed that UMO can't vote for another
>> >> > version
>> >> > >>>>> because it requires 'em to pass that version again. BTW, this
>> >> also
>> >> > >>>>> means that students can only pass the UMO once regardless of
>> >> > version..
>> >> > >>>>>
>> >> > >>>>>
>> >> > >>>> Did you notice circular dependency in these two sentences?
>> >> > >>>> I am not sure whether we want to allow same student to pass
>> >> > different
>> >> > >>>> versions of same UMO or not.
>> >> > >>>>
>> >> > >>>>
>> >> > >>> Imho if Student wants to study new version of UMO, he will have
>> to
>> >> > >>> sign-up
>> >> > >>> for it again. And I think he should be able to submit a vote on
>> >> new
>> >> > >>> version too.
>> >> > >>>
>> >> > >>>
>> >> > >>>
>> >> > >>>> --
>> >> > >>>> Ilya A. Volynets-Evenbakh
>> >> > >>>> Total Knowledge. CTO
>> >> > >>>> http://www.total-knowledge.com
>> >> > >>>>
>> >> > >>>>
>> >> > >>>>
>> >> > >>>>
>> >> > >>>
>> >> > >>>
>> >> > >> --
>> >> > >> Ilya A. Volynets-Evenbakh
>> >> > >> Total Knowledge. CTO
>> >> > >> http://www.total-knowledge.com
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> >
>> >> > --
>> >> > Ilya A. Volynets-Evenbakh
>> >> > Total Knowledge. CTO
>> >> > http://www.total-knowledge.com
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Alexey Parshin,
>> >> http://www.sptk.net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Alexey Parshin,
>> > http://www.sptk.net
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Alexey Parshin,
> http://www.sptk.net
>