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Re: UU & Grading

On 04/05/2011 02:06 PM, Ilya A. Volynets-Evenbakh wrote:
> On 04/04/11 20:05, Anatoly Volynets wrote:
>> I'm not sure I quite understand the problem yet.
>> On 04/04/2011 05:09 PM, Ilya A. Volynets-Evenbakh wrote:
>>> The way I see things, under no conditions same UMO can be completed 
>>> twice.
>> By student? Why not? (Exercicio) Repeticio est mater studiorum.
> There are very few conditions, under which same UMO can be studied more
> then once. Otherwise it turns into a copy-paste job. For those special
> cases,
> we'll need some sort of special handling.

Looks like it's a matter of taste now. In my view, "copy-paste" isn't
something illegal in this case. If a student solves a problem for the
second time then he does it easier. I don't see it as smth. bad. Anyway,
it's for the teacher of the class to worry.

>>> Now suppose problem P is included in both courses C1 and C2. Let's 
>>> say P is auto-graded (for example, it's a simple multiple-choice 
>>> problem). For the sake of simplicity, let's say both C1 and C2 use 
>>> 100-grade system. However, C1 assigns weight of 20 to P, and C2 
>>> weight of 10. Student signs up for two separate classes, e.g. to 
>>> default ones for C1 and C2. Now he solves P while studying C1, and 
>>> thus his grade for solving it becomes 20. What happens next, when he
>>>  goes to study C2?
>> The student will just get 10 for P within C1. Works for me.
> No, it doesn't work. In this scenario he doesn't get graded at all for
> the P in C2, and his overall grade is 20 points lower, undeservedly, since
> he did solve P.

I understand the student won't be graded if the grade is a UMO property,
but grade must work within this class only.

>>> And what happens if the problem is the kind which requires grading
>>> by teacher?
>> My first thought: it cannot be the same teacher, for one. But even if he
>> is--it's his problem, not ours.
> Hmm.. I didn't even consider that it could be the same teacher. Good point.
>>> Of course, as you suggest, we could record the solution student 
>>> provided, and then derive grades for each class separately, but 
>>> something in my gut tells me it's not the right thing to do
>>> (although it might actually be yesterdays bean soup talking).
>> Why? We never considered it important. It is for some teachers and
>> students, especially if they put and study some official courses in UU,
>> but let grading be their toys. If we need to provide tools to
>> attach grades to UMOs, let's provide these tools--on per class basis--I
>> believe this is what any teacher would agree with.
> Hmm... So, suppose we let whole grading thing be completely tied to class
> (as opposed to course or UMO link). What kind of tools (ways to grade)
> do you
> envision?

In programming or functional terms? I just understand that a teacher,
while setting up a class for this course, has to assign grades to the
UMOs contained, if he so wishes. The teacher must understand the
assignment works within the class only. This rises questions then:

1) A course may contain hundreds if not thousands UMOs, so itseems
reasonable to provide a capability to group UMOs within a course and
assign grades by groups.
2) A teacher may set up different classes based on the same course. He
may want to use the same grading, so we need to provide a capability to
save grades.

>>> I guess I was hoping for some more radically different view on what 
>>> grading (or rather evaluation) could be in UU. One purpose of
>>> grading I can see, is to let someone know that specific student did
>>> well enough in specific course, without examining his actual
>>> activities during that course in detail. Another possible application
>>> of this functionality, is to set up competitive environment among
>>> students. Any others?
>> Generally (and specifically for UU, as I see it), grading can work to
>> motivate (or discourage) studies. But again--if a teacher needs it--it
>> his business to use it.
>>> To that end: 1. What does it mean to "complete" an UMO which is not a
>>> problem or test? What functionality for grading should we allow in 
>>> these cases?
>> I don't know how to approach it. Teachers cam create tests on topics,
>> etc: sets of
>> questions, problems, exercises? The 'Test' (I don't remember whether it
>> is an UMO, or not) is presented in UU specs.
> Tests are a UMOs, and are created by authors, not teachers.
> They are linked to container UMOs - topics and courses - again by authors.
>>  2. What functionality can we provide to allow evaluating
>>> graders themselves? IOW, if I'm a potential employer, and am looking
>>>  at someone's UU grade in a CS course, what is there to tell me that
>>>  the grade itself is worth something?
>> I don't remember whether such thing as "UU grade" was ever discussed.
>> There supposed to be different courses and different classes. They must
>> develop their own reputation via communication and statistic. UU as an
>> environment could provide.
> Well - that's exactly what I'm asking. What kind of statistics do we
> provide?

There were some suggestions in specs. Say, popularity of a course
(class) -- among students, employers, professors, expert evaluation,
known outcome, sign up/drop off ratio, etc. We need to set up a flexible
mechanism for ourselves to add/remove such categories.

> Where do we put and expose feedback?

My first pick--for visitors

> Who do we allow to leave feedback?

UU students, UU authors, UU teachers, maybe UU experts if they exist.

>>  3. How do we prevent a student
>>>  from acquiring access to author's view of UMO (especially a 
>>> problem), for example by registering a separate account and creating 
>>> his own course, which would include said UMO?
>> Well, probably, grading and open licensing-sharing do not comply
>> perfectly.
> Maybe.
>>  If we up to provide grading then teacher must do it, and no
>> one, but authorized persons  should have access to the grade property of
>> an UMO.
> It's not about access to grade - that is obvious. The problem is access to
> correct answers. If I want to get 100% in a course, I recreate the course
> as an author, using same UMOs (at least problems and tests), then go in
> and look at answers and use them when taking tests for course/class I study.

No idea. What if a current student is not allowed authoring?

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